LCGB Forums

The ability to post messages is restricted to LCGB members. Any questions contact us at lcgbadmin@googlemail.com

Choke problem & petrol smell

Want to know which carb to choose? Having problems setting up the jetting details on your scooter? Wheter you are using a standard or tuned carb, ask your question here.

Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Sat May 29, 2021 7:21 pm

Hello peeps, can anyone suggest a remedy?
When i start the scooter with choke on it revs uncontrollably but as soon as i flip it off it immediately settles to a nice tickover.
Choke cable 'seems' to be seated ok.
When i return from riding i always turn the petrol off straight away but the scooter once stood reeks of petrol.
I can't see any petrol leaks.
Reed valve motor with 30 phbh delly, remote filter.

Any help appreciated!!
Super
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Fast n Furious » Sun May 30, 2021 12:13 am

Inspect the rubber adaptor that connects the carb to the manifold. These do split eventually and old ones can fail to seal under the jubilee clips. This would give increased revs under choke conditions and will lead to piston failure if not corrected. Sticky's manual has a chapter on this known issue I think?
If yours doesn't have the small aluminium spacer ring in the middle of the adaptor then I would recomend that you fit a new adaptor with this ring.
Also consider disconnecting your fuel pipe from the carb banjo and prove to yourself that the tap actually does turn off with no dripping.
It could be that the carb fuel bowl is overfilling or there is an issue with the choke jet, in which case a carb inspection and overhaul with a new float needle would be a good starting point.
User avatar
Fast n Furious
 
Posts: 1502
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2016 3:56 am
Location: York

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Sun May 30, 2021 9:12 am

Thank you much appreciated. I will have a look today.
Super
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Sun Jun 13, 2021 2:01 pm

First off, thanks to f&f for the advice! Changed float needle and valve, changed manifold flange from MB to Readspeed one which seems a lot sturdier and is steel reinforced on the mounting hole section. Also it is about 5mm shorter in depth giving more panel clearance which is a bonus. Did other checks recommended and fired scoot up and still revving eratically on choke. It was late so left it to this morning. Started it up with choke and it was fine no over revving, but then scoot died. Re fired it up to reems of smoke, backfiring/ four stroking? Kept dieing. Them wouldn't start plug was wet/black. Now no spark so tried new plug ht cap still no spark. So angry I could pop a balloon ! Am I right in suspecting stator failure?

Super
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby ULC Soulagent » Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:55 pm

Gotta love them, fix one issue then another 2 follow along :lol:
User avatar
ULC Soulagent
 
Posts: 2137
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 3:26 pm
Location: Milton Keynes

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Sun Jun 13, 2021 8:36 pm

Yeah your right there, couple weeks ago went for test ride after working on scoot, looked down and the fekin toolbox door had fallen off! :lol:
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby MickYork » Mon Jun 14, 2021 12:35 pm

With smoke and erratic behaviour, you may have a leak on the drive side oil seal........or you may not ?
MickYork
 
Posts: 1476
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:37 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Warkton Tornado No.1 » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:57 pm

Before you do anything else, remove the plug. Next, unscrew the cap & strip some insulation back to copper. Check the other end, though, where it screws into CDI. Check all earth connections (engine to frame etc) Pull any kill switch/key ignition wires to eliminate them.

Kick over with the HT lead only to see if you have a spark. If brave enough, 'feel' for anything.

What have you got?
Warkton Tornado No.1
 
Posts: 2112
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:27 pm

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:14 pm

Thanks all for taking the time to give advice! I'll have another look at the weekend.
Many thanks Super
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:06 pm

Had a visit from knowledge we (ok he) took a look at scoot and found that the kytronic ignition box had failed. Bypassed and fires up perfect and choke works fine. May revert to static timing is 17° still OK for a ts1?

Cheers Super
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby coaster » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:55 pm

superhooper wrote:May revert to static timing is 17° still OK for a ts1?

Cheers Super


17 is fine Roy

Colin
User avatar
coaster
 
Posts: 2647
Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 1:00 pm
Location: Norfolk, Flying 8 Balls

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:28 pm

Cheers Colin, hope all is well with you!
Super
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Knowledge » Tue Jun 15, 2021 10:39 pm

Another victory for Knowspeed.

Smug-mode.
User avatar
Knowledge
 
Posts: 1953
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 11:42 am
Location: Ipswich

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Warkton Tornado No.1 » Wed Jun 16, 2021 12:58 pm

Knowledge wrote:Another victory for Knowspeed.

Smug-mode.


'Practical' versus 'Theory'

Sometimes, the only way you can ensure suggestions are followed, to the letter, is by doing it in person.

Ignition issues are so prevalent with electronic systems, including the 'uprated' aftermarket set-ups, that they must be the main reason for failure.

Even if a spark is present, with electronic systems, there's no assurance that it will be @ the correct time! Unlike contact breakers......

However, worth mentioning (for other readers) that with plug out (but earthed) & the engine spun up via a good drill via the flywheel nut, a strobe will soon verify just how 'reliable' the ignition components are. I've seen wildly erratic timing via that process.
Warkton Tornado No.1
 
Posts: 2112
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:27 pm

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:21 pm

WT1 I like the idea of using points ignition but was the original reason riders went over to electronic ignition because at high revs points they don't work properly?
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby coaster » Wed Jun 16, 2021 11:27 pm

superhooper wrote:WT1 I like the idea of using points ignition but was the original reason riders went over to electronic ignition because at high revs points they don't work properly?


Innocenti fitted heavier sprung points to the GP to address points bounce, some like points but I've spent too many hours rolling about in the cold and wet cleaning and adjusting to bloody things. They require frequent maintenance/adjustment/replacement as do all classic cars still running with points.
User avatar
coaster
 
Posts: 2647
Joined: Fri May 30, 2014 1:00 pm
Location: Norfolk, Flying 8 Balls

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Warkton Tornado No.1 » Thu Jun 17, 2021 2:36 pm

Ha!

The only point (pun intended) I was trying to make (on this occasion ;) ) is that points failure is not subject to erratic timing changes as components fail.

The quality of electronic systems & number of components means that failure can mean a lot more head scratching!

As an aside, some trivia. Long after he had introduced electronic lightweight Ducati Electronica systems, the instigator was still running his Group Six 'sit-up-&-beg' bike on total loss battery fed points. Good old Ray Neal. He probably spent money on flashy cardigans & jumpers, mind you..... :lol:
Warkton Tornado No.1
 
Posts: 2112
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:27 pm

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Knowledge » Thu Jun 17, 2021 9:11 pm

Roy’s ignition has been reset to 17degrees and all is good without the Kytronics box.
User avatar
Knowledge
 
Posts: 1953
Joined: Sat May 31, 2014 11:42 am
Location: Ipswich

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby superhooper » Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:04 pm

coaster wrote:
superhooper wrote:WT1 I like the idea of using points ignition but was the original reason riders went over to electronic ignition because at high revs points they don't work properly?


Innocenti fitted heavier sprung points to the GP to address points bounce, some like points but I've spent too many hours rolling about in the cold and wet cleaning and adjusting to bloody things. They require frequent maintenance/adjustment/replacement as do all classic cars still running with points.

I no longer like the idea of points ignition. Fickle, me?
superhooper
 
Posts: 204
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:23 am

Re: Choke problem & petrol smell

Postby Warkton Tornado No.1 » Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:30 pm

superhooper wrote:
coaster wrote:
superhooper wrote:WT1 I like the idea of using points ignition but was the original reason riders went over to electronic ignition because at high revs points they don't work properly?


Innocenti fitted heavier sprung points to the GP to address points bounce, some like points but I've spent too many hours rolling about in the cold and wet cleaning and adjusting to bloody things. They require frequent maintenance/adjustment/replacement as do all classic cars still running with points.

I no longer like the idea of points ignition. Fickle, me?


I completely understand that, as why wouldn't you want to ensure the investment made in an electronic system should work?

However, anybody that expects reliability from the common-or-garden Indian produced kits are eluding themselves.

The greatest advantage to the electronic ignitions that I own & trust are the capability of adjusting the firing point. For that purpose, I am a convert, but my faith lies with Motoplat, PVL, Piaggio & Selettra (Malossi use Selettra) as well as first generation AFR.

I hope we've done this to death now! An all too common problem with an electronic ignition kit fooled you, like many others, into thinking there was a fuelling problem. No doubt, such an occurrence will happen again :roll:
Warkton Tornado No.1
 
Posts: 2112
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:27 pm

Next

Return to Carburettors

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests