Electrical help with LED indicators

[Jono]

I am becoming confused due to lack of electrical knowledge , having installed LED indicators on scooter all works well except that when flashing the LED lights do not go completely out in off cycle. Have installed a 10watt Resistor after Diodes to single warning light and lights almost go out. The Flasher unit is LED compatible and the Indicator Lights are 2 watts (4 watts per side).
If I insert a 21 Watt bulb in place of the Resistor all works fine, does this mean if I double up with Resistors (2 x 10 Watts)
Will this be ok .
Jono

[MK Monty]

here we go again
Why did you put the resistor after the diodes between them and the warning tel tail light you have just reduced the amount of juice going to that one light so its gone dim. Your flasher is a 2 pin unit. It has a supply going to one pin then the other goes to your switch that you then point left or right. Your resistor goes between the 2nd pin and your switch that way you are adding 10w load to your left hand side or your right hand side indicators. If you had bought 2 resistors you could have fitted one after the switch on the right side line and one on the left.
You are simply adding 10W load after the flasher and before the switch and your leds

[Jono]

MK Monty
Thanks for info, will change installation in morning and give it a try.
I have 2 resistors so will put one into each of the wires from switch to R/H and L/H indicators.
Will follow your advice and hopefully resolve the problem once and for all.
Once again many thanks.
Jono

[Jono]

Hi it's me again MK Monty
Tried this morning introducing 10 Watt Resistor into feed from flasher unit to switch.
The system works, however two of the 10 LED's in each indicators still say on in a dim state when the flasher unit is in off cycle .
Also tried Resistor in each indicator circuit and still the same fault .
Again checked with a 21 Watt bulb in warning light position and system works great, suggesting I may need a bigger Resistor?? Wondering if the relay may be the issue (sold as LED), what sort of wattage you you expect a LED Flasher Unit to require to function correctly?
Jono
Ps: just tried a 10 Watt bulb in place of warning light and system works fine, shame I can not fit such a bulb in warning lamp,I do not understand why 10 Watt Resistor does not have same impact.

[Jono]

Think issue is caused by myself in not specifying the right size resistor in terms of Ohm's. Although 10 watts I have 100 Ohm's
Resistor. If I need to simulate 10 Watt Bulb to make system work then perhaps I need Resistor closer to 15 ohm's.
If anybody who is electrically minded could confirm this I would be extremely grateful
As you will appreciate I am totally out of my comfort zone . Jono

[dickie]

Think issue is caused by myself in not specifying the right size resistor in terms of Ohm's. Although 10 watts I have 100 Ohm's
Resistor. If I need to simulate 10 Watt Bulb to make system work then perhaps I need Resistor closer to 15 ohm's.
If anybody who is electrically minded could confirm this I would be extremely grateful
As you will appreciate I am totally out of my comfort zone . Jono

The wattage does not affect the flash rate, you just need it to be big enough so that it doesn't overheat and burn out. I would guess that 20 watts is easily big enough. If 20 watts is enough , then a million watts will perform the same.

It's the resistance and where you connect it that matters.

Think of it this way. Indicator lamps are usually 15watts and there are 2 so they absorb 30watts at 12v = 2.5amps. Leds use almost nothing so the relay that feeds them behaves incorrectly.

Consequently you need to put about 10 ohms in parallel. If it flashes too fast put a lower ohms value in parallel. If it's too slow do the opposite.

Ciaro?

[Jono]

Dickie
Thanks explanation, I think perhaps I have the wrong size Risestors because whatever I do the LEDs do not go completely off during the flashing cycle. I have tried one in each side of the indicator and also in supply to switch and issue remains.

Connect a 10 watt bulb in supply to indicator warning lamp and all fine. The Resistors I have are 10watts 100 ohms Aluminium clad. Any technical help you can forward would be appreciated . I just need a resistor that simulates a 10 watt bulb?
Jono

[MK Monty]

I thought I had already replied to this last night but obviously not, Ouso is my excuse
You have put a 10w resistor after the switch one on the left and one on the right if Im reading this OK
You tried 1 resistor after the flasher but before the switch Yes??
Add the 2nd resistor end on end so flasher connected to one end of the 1st resistor then the 2nd resistor finally going to your switch, you have then added 20w to your load irrespective of what side indicator you select

[dickie]

Then it's easy. A 10 or 15 ohm resistor will simulate your original lamp. I'd go for 15 but definitely not less than 10. 5 watt will be ok as it's only on 50% of the cycle and they cycle is infrequent anyway.

[Jono]

MK Monty
Thanks for persevering with me and testing your patiance.
Have tried what you suggested and the system does not work at all well , buzzer hardly works and flashing not good.
I assume I did what you said, joined two resistors together then connected one free end to flasher unit and other to switch supply.
System works perfectly,flashing sequence and on / off LEDs and buzzer with 10 watt bulb added to warning light circuit, warning light also ok.
If only I could simulate bulb load with a Resistor all would be ok.
As a matter interest should Ressitors be wired in parallel with indicator wiring (which is what I have tried in the main ) or in series which I have just done. At present I am totally perplexed and feel like stuffing a 10 watt bulb behind the horn casting and all will be well.
However,I realise this is not the correct solution and will continue to seek a satisfactory solution.
Kind regards Jono

[Jono]

Dickie
Thanks for your suggestion , it sounds like it will give me the solution I am looking for.
For clarification are we talking about 10watt 15 Ohm's Resistor.
Wired in parallel I assume.
Sorry for questions but I am currently confused given their are so many permutations of Resistor Watts/Ohm's
Thanks for you assistance in this matter, installation of the indicator system went so well and looks great,
however, having spent 3 days trying to sort out such a silly issue beginning to wish I had stayed with hand signals ( not really as considered a safety issue with condition of roads and volume of traffic).
Kind regards. Jono

[dickie]

For clarification are we talking about 10watt 15 Ohm's Resistor

In a nutshell, yes you're right

[MK Monty]

Or get the correct flasher

[Jono]

Thanks chaps for help - will take trip to Maplins for 10watt 15ohms resistor and check results .
Finding a Flasher Relay for such low wattage is proving a major task although the unit I have is sold as a LED unit.Clearly, my LED units at 2 watts ( 4 watts per side L/H - R/H + warning light) are insufficient load for Flasher Unit.
Let's hope new resistor simulates my 10 Watt Bulb as all is ok when in this mode ie : flashing rate / warning light / buzzer & illumination of LED,s work satisfactorily.

Would be interested if anyone could recommend a source of supply for a Flasher Unit that is known to work at such a low load.
Jono

[dickie]

Forget about watts, they are only specified on resistors to stop them burning out.

The load is determined by the voltage and ohms.

Get 15 ohms and at least 10 watts. If you buy 15 ohms and 100 watts it will behave in EXACTLY the same way.

[Jono]

Dickie
Thanks for help, installed 15 watt Resistor and all is now fine . Indicators are great and single warning light using diodes works just as it should. A great safety mod given the state of our roads it,s best to keep both hands on handle bars.
Many thanks to you and MK Monty. Jono