New project - winter model

[Topgearskin]

Excuse the interruption, but whenever I’ve swapped rivets for high tensile socket screws, thus far, I’ve always managed to tap the actual flywheel centre boss to M6. This gives even more clearance & is also marginally lighter

Then it’s just a case of using high tensile button head screws with a dab of Loctite threadlock. As there is often the ring plate (as in the case depicted) additional washers are not required (IMHO)

However, if you are hamfisted, cannot drill & tap square & your test of the correct torque is by stripping the threads(!) then drill through & use nuts on the back....

I'm definitely hamfisted. I think the torque test will be achievable though - what torque setting would you recommend

[Warkton Tornado No.1]

Postby Topgearskin » Tue Mar 21, 2017 5:19 pm

Warkton Tornado No.1 wrote:
Excuse the interruption, but whenever I’ve swapped rivets for high tensile socket screws, thus far, I’ve always managed to tap the actual flywheel centre boss to M6. This gives even more clearance & is also marginally lighter

Then it’s just a case of using high tensile button head screws with a dab of Loctite threadlock. As there is often the ring plate (as in the case depicted) additional washers are not required (IMHO)

However, if you are hamfisted, cannot drill & tap square & your test of the correct torque is by stripping the threads(!) then drill through & use nuts on the back....

I'm definitely hamfisted. I think the torque test will be achievable though - what torque setting would you recommend

If the threads are first class, & dependent upon the parent material ('standard' Lambretta flywheel hubs are good steel) they should cope with a maximum torque of 7.5 ft/lb (10 Nm)....

(Famous Last Words....Gulp!)

[dickie]

Moving forward eventually. Got the frame back from Shaun Burns after being on his jig, the usual repairs, plus some minor mods to accommodate the remote master cylinder and glovebox.



My wife was out. It's in the garage now

[steve t]

Looking forward to seeing this go back together

[dickie]

i couldn't find any new springs for the side panel handles so i tried soaking them in vinegar for a few days to get the rust off. worked pretty well, but i wouldn't be happy to use it for anything on show. These were really bad and crusty, but just discoloured now. I've coated them in grease so they'll be good for at least another couple of decades yet.

2017-11-01_09-37-12 by richardhenderson1968, on Flickr

2017-11-01_09-36-56 by richardhenderson1968, on Flickr

[dickie]

I got the last of my bodywork back from Shaun Evans - he's effing good he is. This stuff was scrap metal to most people.

2017-11-01_09-37-28 by richardhenderson1968, on Flickr

I couldn't make my mind up whether to go all grey or the combination you see above. If I don't like it (and I don't think I do), I'll just get the side panels and horncasting painted grey. John Major would approve.

[dickie]

a bit more progress. Rewired bgm stator for dc. I also changed the LT pick up for one from anthony tambs.

2017-11-11_02-03-40 by richardhenderson1968

fitted a 33000microfarad capacitor instead of a battery. i have 2 concerns about this: firstly as it's electrolytic, if i've wired it reverse polarity, it will explode and it's right nest to the tank; secondly it's very large, so will present a short circuit to the rectifier at start up, possibly blowing the output stage. We'll see

2017-11-11_02-02-47 by richardhenderson1968

I always do this on wiring looms; tin the crimps and they'll last a 100 years. I also grease them before connecting to lights etc. Both easy jobs but make a huge dofference to reliability.

2017-11-11_02-04-04 by richardhenderson1968

[dickie]

built the forks up over the Christmas break when I wasn't fixing my mother's house up; I wish my dad had some DIY skills!


MB disc links, MB progressive springs and MB non-adjustable dampers. I'd have preferred the adjustable ones obviously, but then I couldn't fit gaiters and they'd look too modern for my sensibilities.
2017-12-19_11-17-11 by richardhenderson1968

The damper mounts have a nut welded on so that I can remove the dampers with the turning mudguard in place.

2017-12-19_11-16-55 by richardhenderson1968

I forgot to order the rubber dampers that fit in the inner mudguard, so I built them without and fitted the forks to the frame. But it was niggling away at me so I had to remove the forks and fit them.

20171219_203538 by richardhenderson1968

Neither the upper nor lower bearing race would fit in the frame, so some precision machining was required.
2017-12-19_11-16-38 by richardhenderson1968

once the forks were in, the headset bottom wasn't sitting straight. So I cleaned the paint off the headset so that the bracket could sit squarely, and all was well.
2017-12-19_11-15-42 by richardhenderson1968

[dickie]

on my last project I used a nylon drive and it lasted all of 5 minutes so I decided to use steel one from mb before it failed. Anyway, I got a bit carried away when I was removing the nylon one - nobhead.
2017-12-30_06-36-54 by richardhenderson1968

Consequently I had to fashion a collar from some brass tube (£10 from ebay). It was less than .05mm undersize (best resolution i can get with verniers) so I slit it so that it could conform to the steel worm drive. I had to dremmel about 0.2mm from the inner surface for it to fit onto the hub. Then I used high strength bearing retainer. Should be ok; there's not exactly a massive load going through it.
2017-12-30_06-36-32 by richardhenderson1968

Balls up number 2. I used mypol inner tubes as I heard they were perfect fit; they're not. Or at least they're not with these stainless split rims. Maybe the valve hole is in the wrong place? Anyway, I'll use a michelin B4 tube as they're 90°. This tube will be ok for the front on my S3.
2018-01-02_03-41-04 by richardhenderson1968

Balls up number 3. Well, not really a balls up, more just that the part failed immediately. When I pushed the engine bolt through, It pushed the middle part of the mount out! I really only tapped it through with a nylon hammer, so it wasn't brutality that killed it; honest. Anyway, despite me buying this 2 years ago, a nice man from Doncaster has given me the cost of it off a new pair of BGM ones.
2018-01-02_03-40-26 by richardhenderson1968

[dickie]

Today I built the front hub up as I'm not going to fit the motor until I can put the rear wheel on which is waiting for an inner tube.

I did all the stuff recommended on here about cleaning up the pins, copperslip, opening out the disc holes and you can tell it works better just by operating it in your hand. The pads that came with it seemed like crap so I decided to fit sintered ones. Once they were fitted I couldn't spin the disc as the new ones were about 0.5mm thicker than the supplied ones. Even with the static pad backed right off the wheel locked up.
2018-01-04_02-17-02 by richardhenderson1968

So I fitted a pair of washers behind the caliper until the pads wear a bit. The caliper screws are under tension when the brake operates, but this is sure to allow some bending moment through them in use. Opinions; is this a daft idea or not? I don't really want to file/grind the new pads down as I'm unlikely to get them level.
2018-01-04_02-16-48 by richardhenderson1968, on Flickr

[Knowledge]

Excuse my ignorance here, but is this a remade traditional style inboard disc brake, with a modified static plate with a bolt-on hydraulic caliper? I haven't seen this before. Have a you a more traditional photo showing the set-up, so I can get my head around it?

As far as the oversize disc pads are concerned, could they not be held in a lathe and turned down by that 0.5mm that you require? Otherwise, do what you are planning until the pads are worn, than then remove the intermediate washers. My principle concern about your proposal is the ingress of dirt and salt, that might cause the pad to seize.

Good photo-story. Keep it up.

[dickie]

Excuse my ignorance here, but is this a remade traditional style inboard disc brake, with a modified static plate with a bolt-on hydraulic caliper? I haven't seen this before. Have a you a more traditional photo showing the set-up, so I can get my head around it?

As far as the oversize disc pads are concerned, could they not be held in a lathe and turned down by that 0.5mm that you require? Otherwise, do what you are planning until the pads are worn, than then remove the intermediate washers. My principle concern about your proposal is the ingress of dirt and salt, that might cause the pad to seize.

Good photo-story. Keep it up.

Thanks Martin, it's one of these:
2018-01-04_06-04-37 by richardhenderson1968

I could, but I don't have a lathe and can't be arsed to get someone else to do it! I suppose i could do it on my belt sander and keep rotating the face so that it sort of averages a level surface? Alternatively I could easily put an o-ring in the gap until it wears. The prime area for moisture etc to be a concern would be the piston/cylinder interface and that's (sort of) open to the elements anyway as it's only protected by the pad and disc, neither of which form a seal. They do afford some protection though.

[Knowledge]

Thanks for the photo Richard

[dickie]

Sorted the brake out by linishing 0.8mm from each pad. I has mis-measured the first time; rather than 0.5mm difference, it was actually 1.5mm per pad! Anyway, it's sorted now.

Put the new Michelin B4 inner tube in the rear rim, so now there's loads of clearance for the valve and I was able to install the engine into the frame. I used an MB inlet to help with frame clearance and a protech shock (297mm between centres) and the inlet still hit the frame; i guess this is because I have a 3mm reed packer.
2018-01-07_06-21-48 by richardhenderson1968

So I had to remove some metal from the top of the inlet. Eccentric frame cones popped into my head, but only briefly as I hate the idea of them.
2018-01-07_06-21-06 by richardhenderson1968

10 installation/file/removal cycles later and the clearance is enough to keep me happy. Using an MB frame/inlet clearance gauge I was confident that they'll never make contact on the road.
2018-01-07_06-20-49 by richardhenderson1968

[dickie]

The front spindle won't tighten up. Am I missing some parts or do I just need to shorten the spindle?
2018-01-07_06-20-15 by richardhenderson1968

The dome nuts obviously are bottoming out so I could use some plain nuts but the they wouldn't look right. Anyway, if I'm missing something, it needs sorting anyway.

2018-01-07_06-20-01 by richardhenderson1968

[Knowledge]

Are you certain that the dome nuts are bottoming out? Whenever I have bottomed out that style of dome nut, it pushes off the dome cap.

Perhaps it is a very tight nylon insert, as the spindle is notoriously difficult to hold while tightening the nuts, especially when new.

Just a thought.

[dickie]

Are you certain that the dome nuts are bottoming out? Whenever I have bottomed out that style of dome nut, it pushes off the dome cap.

Perhaps it is a very tight nylon insert, as the spindle is notoriously difficult to hold while tightening the nuts, especially when new.

Just a thought.

You were right of course. I just didn't want to force it when I wasn't even sure if I'd fitted all the nuts, washers etc. I find those diagrams tricky to read sometimes. Thanks again.

[dickie]

I'm trying to decide how/where to fit my CHT probe. It won't reasonably fit under the plug on my avanti head and would be wrecked after a few plug chops too. So i'm thinking about on top of plug with some tube to secure it, where i reckon it will give the fastest response but will read low
2018-01-08_08-07-10 by richardhenderson1968

or fin next to plug. Where i reckon it will read low and respond slow:
2018-01-08_08-07-54 by richardhenderson1968

or the back of the head. probably slowest and lowest
2018-01-08_08-07-31 by richardhenderson1968

I'd prefer to use the top of the plug, but just want to check it's ok before I start fitting cables etc and the engine becomes a pain to remove. Also, what sort of temps should i expect from a cool/optimum engine?

[Warkton Tornado No.1]

There have been several other Forum users with the same issue & fitted the ring on top of the plug retained by cut back caps.

However, I would consider making up a stepped washer (top hat) that has a spigot to fit the hole of the ring but a nat's shorter (spigot length) to clamp the ring to the head. Then it can be fitted onto one of the cylinder studs in direct contact with the head.

I reason that the temperature there will be not far off the under plug location & more reliable/responsive than using a fin....

[dickie]

However, I would consider making up a stepped washer (top hat) that has a spigot to fit the hole of the ring but a nat's shorter (spigot length) to clamp the ring to the head. Then it can be fitted onto one of the cylinder studs in direct contact with the head.

I reason that the temperature there will be not far off the under plug location & more reliable/responsive than using a fin....

Yes, I like that. As I don't have easy access to a machine shop I'll do it by using a pair or washers to form the top.that though. Thanks.