Mugello 198 advice

[Gary Harwood]

I have had a Mugello 186 on my TV3 for the last 6 years and I have done approx. 14,000 miles with it with no problems. It was probably the best modification I could have made at the time (the 198 was not available then) and I can not praise it enough.

I also have a TV2 that I am now thinking of putting a Mugello 198 on. What's everyone's experience with the 198? Is it as reliable as the 186? What gearing, carb and exhaust set up would be best with it and what sort of performance could I expect? I am not someone who thrashes the guts out of my scoots but I do cover a fair amount of miles on them and I regularly go on long, overseas runs. I therefore am looking for a set up that would allow me to ride the S2 at 60 mph ish for miles and miles and miles!

[Jamesy]

What set up do you have with the 186

[stonerosesmod]

I had the 186 and then went to my current 198 mugello on my S3.I noticed a slight improvement on torque over the 186 but nothing mega.Done around 900 miles on it so far and run a 26phbh through ram air and Li150 gearing at 16x47.I ride solo and it has been fine for me,did run for a while with an Ancillotti and was a really grunty set up (probably ideal for you) which pulled really well to around 60 and maxed out around 62mph.Recently changed to a Franspeed JL3,lost a little low down torque but pulls better at 55/60 now as its in the powerband and cruises easily at 65.Given the choice id go for the 198 but the spigots very thin so it needs to be handled carefully.Mine seemed to run out the box fine and all i did was match the inlet manifold to the barrel a bit better and set the squish with the different base gaskets provided.People are mentioning the RT195 kits to match if not be better than the mugello,but ive never ridden one so i cant compare.

Neil.

[dave411]

This is very interesting.Neil,thats the exact same set up as i am going to be using in my li.Even down to the 150 gearing.Sixty mph is fast enough for me,low down power/torque is what i am looking for,and by the sounds of it this is perfect.I am a happy bunny now

[Gary Harwood]

What set up do you have with the 186

I have a 26mm carb with RamAir filter, Li150 gears, GP crank and Ancillotti exhaust with the 186 on my S3.

Neil, your 198 set up with an Ancillotti sounds good. A mate of mine has put a 198 on his TV with a 28mm carb and small bore Gori. Says it cruises comfortably at 60 mph. But it's a S3 and I am looking to an upgrade for my S2. Now this might be my imagination but my S2 feels a lot heavier than my S3 and, if it really is, I am interested to hear how the 198 on a S2 performs.

[mickey c]

I've got one a series 2 but it's difficult to compare with the 186 on my GP, partly because of different weight, handling etc but also I've had (another) mid life crisis & put loads of chrome on my series 2! The GP is as god intended! If it helps the series 2 sits happily at 60 - 65 all day, just doesn't like bends! Reckon it'll go quicker but my bottle won't allow it!

I can be of some use if you want to run an AF clubman and 30 dellorto as it's been dynoed? Can't remember the exact set up but happy to dig it out if it helps?

[Gary Harwood]

Thanks Mickey. That sounds good as I too have a fair amount of chrome additions in the form of front crash bars, spotlights, mirrors, mascots and back rack/carrier on my S2. If it will sit happily at 60+ all day it will suit me fine. So you've helped me make up my mind. I just need to save up for the bits and then..........198 TV2 here we come!

[piskie]

I have a muggy 186 on my series two john manns old scooter its done more miles than the star ship enterprise reliable but a plodder if I wanted to update it I would stick a 60mm crank in it that improves them no end x

[dave411]

How does a longer conrod improve performance?

[dickie]

How does a longer conrod improve performance?

It's not the rod, but the stroke that is changed thereby increasing capacity and torque slightly.

[stonerosesmod]

I take it you need a 1mm packer plate and this will get port timings correct at TCD,but at BDC wouldnt port timings be out? Or is it as simple as using a 60mm crank with the packer?

[dickie]

I take it you need a 1mm packer plate and this will get port timings correct at TCD,but at BDC wouldnt port timings be out? Or is it as simple as using a 60mm crank with the packer?

Without meaning to be a dick, port timings will change at all angles other than those at 90 degrees before and after tdc and bdc. Whether they change for the better or worse depends on what kind of tune you're after. Generally speaking they'll push power further up the rev range although only marginally.

Exhaust will be open a little longer and transfers will open a little earlier, thereby reducing blowdown slightly.

While the above is correct, it's very mathematical as I've never tried a long stroke crank since 1989 on a p200e and can't remember what difference it made.